What happened to....

[aaubballmom]

The FFS 16's at AAU Nationals? I was looking at the brackets on line last night and they aren't listed in the team list or in any of the pools. I'd have thought they'd have been seeded first in some pool, but the pool where they'd seem to logically be has the #1 spot listed as "TBD". Did they just decide to forgo AAU this year and concentrate on the Nike circuit instead?

[teammom4]

No proof, but after all the illegal player talk about LM, its now being said that FFS had three or four illegal players...anyone want to deny or confirm. I heard this a few weeks ago.

[Theguru]

I am not sure about a "few" but at least one and yes word on street is that they might be ineligible. The 5th seed listed as TBD is theirs and its possible that AAU has not ruled yet. the Stars website list a PA girl on the roster and in the news section state they qualified as the 5th seed. On a side note AAU is also ruling on LM 14u situation too.

[pgcop]

yeah I hear pretty much the same thing, I heard that kb got at least one kid from pa but did not intend to play aau but showcase like bw. when ffs filed a protest on the majics gold medal with their kid from pa it became more of an issue. I also heard am & kb had issues with each other over this.

[bballmom]

Hate to see the players hurt by this, but all I can say is ITS ABOUT TIME someone busted AM and FFS program. They are sooo twisted the way they go about their biz and recruiting especially. They lie to families all the time to get what they want. Now if we can just get that old 1990 something AAU Champion windbreaker off her no coach brother BM.

[hoopsfl]

Hate to see the players hurt by this, but all I can say is ITS ABOUT TIME someone busted AM and FFS program. They are sooo twisted the way they go about their biz and recruiting especially. They lie to families all the time to get what they want. Now if we can just get that old 1990 something AAU Champion windbreaker off her no coach brother BM.

I'm with you bmom. I've seen FFS recruit for years and never worry about dumping kids that actually live in FAIRFAX that have been with them for 1 or more years.

[bballmom]

They should change their name to the Maryland Stars anyway. No wait - how about the Tri-State Stars I almost forgot about PA.

I woder what Nike will think? My guess is that they are on thin ice with them since Curtis S. told them to take their bada$$ ways and get out.

[bballfan]

I think its about time the Fairfax Stars got what was coming to them (a little karma). To think AM had the nerve to question the lady majic when her own teams were shady. Now the 16s and 15s aren't going to nationals this year and I have little symphathy for that program.

[arbitraryj]

I was told earlier in the summer that the FFS Natl 16s folded cuz the coach was sub par- then AM decided to send the Nike Elite to git her n the bruh another trophy for the mantel- maybe a new windbreaker.

ballmom, you are killling me!! ROTFLOL!!!!!:D

Anydoodah, as a previous post stated AAU rules would prohibit a PV team from having more than 3 out of district players FFS is famous for pulling kids from surrounding counties like Prince William, Loudon, as far as Hampton & Philly to get at another paper weight.

Hey maybe she needed a replacement leg for the cauldron?

(Hmm. I shouldn't be so petty. Ya'll pray for me :( )

[pgmom]

This forum is a little out of control and really mean. An AAU district is not the same as a county, so any great AAU team in Potomac valley district is going to pull players from more than one county. And you can have players from neighborhing districts like the Maryland and Virginia districts, with a limit. Also, parents and players decide where to play, so it sounds like sour grapes to say that an organization "recruits." Ya'll make parents and players seem like morons when you post stuff like that. Finally, elite teams winnow and build as the years go on....so that the best play with the best and everyone else finds their ability-level team. There's nothing new there. It's just the way the system works for teams that want to compete at an elite level nationally. It's the same with the Tenn. Flight or the Philly Belles, etc.

[lboogie]

You all know the board rules on personal attacks..let's try to keep it civil.

Remember it is about the kids:D

[bballmom]

and don't anyone ever forget it. It bothers me to see FFS take advantage of families and kids to what means? For every kid they pick up through long distance recruiting, legit or not, they tend to throw away a kid that has been beating her brains out for the club for several years.

They are the only club I know that really is more interested in titles and winning reputation than actually developing players. They can't develop them, so they just go out and pull in other already developed players under the guise of being the one and only great club in PV. Have you ever seen a FFS 10 yr. old, or 11 yr.old team that could even make left hand layups? It is laughable to me to call Mr. BM Windbreaker a player development director.

Has AM ever actually developed a team through coaching? Seems to me that she just amasses whatever talent she can lie, cheat or steal and then stalks the sidelines and beats up referees. There's even alot of talk about how she now has her own referees in Potomac Valley on the Stars payroll.

Whatever your personal position on FFS, AM is a very smart lady who needs to understand that the rules are meant for her as well, and she could be running a truly great club if they just cleaned up their act and stopped breaking the rules, lying to everyone, badmouthing everyone that isn't in the FFS club, showed some fraternal respect for the AAU efforts of others, and worked at developing players like everyone else.

[hoopsfl]

I'm with you again bbmom. There's nothing wrong with winning but I question a philosophy that puts winning in front of kids and alienates other AAU and basketball clubs. If it's truly about the kids, then the clubs and programs should be willing to work together.

[lloyd]

You guys would not listen to me years ago when I told you how FFS were operating, they tried to say that I had girls that were to old, and would try to steal my players, that I have put the work in to get there games to the next level. I am just glad that you guys finally see the light. Now maybe you will keep your kids on our side of the town, which by the way is PG COUNTY. Where the real Baller are. To teach a kids how to play is so rewarding, to steal a kid from a program where they are truly learning is a crying shame. So the next time you go after a kid think of the kid not the Win.

[HighLevel]

You guys would not listen to me years ago when I told you how FFS were operating, they tried to say that I had girls that were to old, and would try to steal my players, that I have put the work in to get there games to the next level. I am just glad that you guys finally see the light. Now maybe you will keep your kids on our side of the town, which by the way is PG COUNTY. Where the real Baller are. To teach a kids how to play is so rewarding, to steal a kid from a program where they are truly learning is a crying shame. So the next time you go after a kid think of the kid not the Win.

like someone said in an earlier post; parents are going to make their own decisions. I'm all for talent staying in PG County but you can't knock a good hustle. They've done enough to have not only good PV teams but a nationally known program. Who wouldn't give consideration to possibly having a little more visibility for their child. If you keep your ear close enough to the streets you'll hear rumors of coaches within PG County stealing players from other teams. Personally I don't believe anyone steals anyone. If someone can convince a player and their parent that they have a better opportunity for them and that same player and parent believe that then they move, no one has stolen them. You steal material things. As a coach I'm not even going to entertain the thought that someone stole a player from me if he/she decides to leave for what they believe is a better situation. Either we just don't agree or I truly haven't been doing my job!

[hoopsdiva27]

FFS is not the only program that commits the sin of recruiting players or pushing players out to bring in new ones. And they are not the only program in town that wants to win at all costs. We have been on both sides of the bridge looking for that "great" program and I am here to tell you they are all the same

[michaeliceman]

I am a coach at another big organization in PVAAU. I take pride in the fact that I have always worked well with the NoVA organizations. My teams (and my entire organization) have always had great relations with the Cardinals, Vogues, WFBC etc. We also have great relationships with the other prominent organizations on the East Coast (Fencor, Belles, CJ Hawks). We support their tournmanents and they suppport ours. The one organization that we have not been able to really work with is the FFS. We have decent relationships with individual coaches but not the organization as a whole. They win and I applaud them for that. But is winning and sponsorship more important than the spirit and the principles of AAU? There just seems to be an organizational arrogance.

I also believe that there is a concept of stealing players (or negative recruiting) and I have personally witnessed from a FFS coach because it involved my daughter. I understand that it is the parents' decision to move their kid. But you also have to look at why. If a parent moves a kid to the FFS because they believe that it will help the child, increase visibility, etc. I will support it even though I do not agree with it in every case. But if a FFS coach (or any coach) tells a parent that their current organization/coach is not good, second rate, I think that is inappropriate.

[arbitraryj]

I'm all for talent staying in PG County but you can't knock a good hustle. They've done enough to have not only good PV teams but a nationally known program. Who wouldn't give consideration to possibly having a little more visibility for their child.

I would love -yes, I relish ANY opportunity to knock each and every hustle that leaves CHILDREN in the wake of national notoriety.

I could give a [self edit] where the program resides. I can speak from experience about the FFS but I eagerly concede that it would be BIG news to find a club in the USA that wasn't operating on some level just like AM and her [self edit] excuse for coaches.

Sometimes the AAU circuit looks more like a CULT than a club. I'm sure all of us can easily count 20+ kids we know personally that have been "sacrificed" to the altar of National Championship Trophies and Program recognition. I can probably rattle off 20+ just from the FFS program. I've seen coaches cast off babies. We are talking 8,9,10,11 year old girls because they figure it is easier to recruit than to develop. If it were merely about the best talent I could understand- after all this is a competitive sport. But too often it becomes about adult politics and a pay for play type environment. Get mom and dad on a certain board or writing checks and your in like a play cousin even if you can't dribble. The FFS are famous for making decisions based on the wrong motives. Someone said this is not the first year that very same FFS age group was bounced for violating this boundary rule.

AAU was not designed to benefit adults and coaches over the children. Its easy to forget that each of the players regularly featured on this site have had- still have- many, many teammates that will never ever make it to the next level in this game.

That does NOT excuse anyone from treating these CHILDREN like they are less than. As a parent wrapped up in the cult myself, I understand how easy it is to find yourself drinking that "exposure" flavored Kool-aid. If the only thing these girls can hope to gain from all these years of dedication to the game is a free ride to school, they would all be better off to just stay home and study harder.

Our RESPONSIBILITY to our kids is to check ourselves periodically and all those sowing seeds into their lives to make sure we are serving their best LONG TERM interests and goals.

[4street]

So, we have it on absolute fact that the Stars turned in the Lady Majic for an illegal player? Who turned in the Stars? Also, where is the logic of risking the status of the elite team in your organization just so your 14U team could move from a 3 seed to a 1 seed in at Nationals? There are teams that would have much more to gain by that move than the Stars.

[hoopsfl]

Kudos to arbitraryj and michaeliceman.

Diva, NOT all programs are the same. Some don't have the philosophy to win at all costs and discard loyal kids. Some don't place kids on teams becasue a parent makes a large $$ denotation. As parents, what are we telling are kids if we move them from one program to another solely for the sake of winning? What about loyalty and committment to teammates? Winning may come in the short-term but sometimes long-term skill development is what's sacrificed.

[aaubballmom]

Wow! I think I inadvertently opened a Pandora's box. In reading others' thoughts about development vs winning as priorities, I guess I can't find fault with either philosophy. I just want coaches to be honest. If it's about winning and not about development (or the other way around), then just be up front about it. What I would find troublesome is a coach saying it's about development when it's really about winning at all cost. I can always take my kid somewhere else for skill development (and have done so) if I know up front that it's not a focus with that particular team.

If it turns out that the FFS are ineligible, then I feel really bad for the kids. As is usually the case, it's the kids who get the short end of the stick when adults mess up. They are a very skilled group of players and I wish them well no matter what happens with the AAU's ruling.

[4street]

Who says that skill development and winning are mutually exclusive? Winning and competing just like any other aspect of basketball is a skill that needs to be developed. Too often, winning or the desire to win is looked upon as almost a sin in youth sports. Too often, parents mask their own frustrations behind altruistic rhetoric about the evil of winning.

[michaeliceman]

Oh, the FFS trigger a lot of emotion in folks. I wear two hats and I do understand both sides. As a parent, there is a certain benefit to playing in an organization like the FFS, if that is what I wanted for my kid. Once I made that decision, my main concern as a parent would be loyalty and commitment to the development of my kid. For example AM's 13U FFS have 14-15 kids on the team. Approximately 6 of those kids have came from other organizations since September. This FFS team qualified for the Nationals the last two years and although they did not do much damage there, they were considered an up and coming team. This year, with the 6 new kids being the focus of the team, they won the PVAAU for that age group. Bringing 6 kids over the course of the year is a lot different than bringing in 1-2 to get you over the hump. If I am a parent on that team and my daughter was loyal to the organization for the past 2 years, I would question the FFS' commitment to developing and showcasing my child. They won the Region but everyone else rolls their eyes when they talk about how they won it.

As a coach, I just think that there is a way to go about things. I have been coaching AAU for over 10 years and I have never approached a kid/parent from another organization abut leaving that team to play for me. In fact, I have had to turn away players because I did not want it to appear that something shady took place. I find that my players and parents are the best recruiters. They like how I run the team and the word spreads that way. Like everyone I want to win. But I want to be able to hold my head up and not have people question my integrity.

[aaubballmom]

I don't think that skill development and winning HAVE to be mutually exclusive, but sometimes they are. The ideal situation, of course, would be one where the two go hand in hand. Unfortunately, I have seen situations where winning was so important to the coach that they only bothered to develop skills for the starters and didn't worry about the bench. While that may work out, in the long run I think you only go as far as your bench will let you. I have also seen teams jettison kids who with just a little extra work could have developed into solid players in favor of an already developed kid from another team just so they could up their winning percentage. Again, if you're going to do that, be up front so that at least a kid knows they'll probably be cut the next year when you go out recruiting.

[monkeyc]

For example AM's 13U FFS have 14-15 kids on the team. Approximately 6 of those kids have came from other organizations since September. This FFS team qualified for the Nationals the last two years and although they did not do much damage there, they were considered an up and coming team. This year, with the 6 new kids being the focus of the team, they won the PVAAU for that age group. Bringing 6 kids over the course of the year is a lot different than bringing in 1-2 to get you over the hump. If I am a parent on that team and my daughter was loyal to the organization for the past 2 years, I would question the FFS' commitment to developing and showcasing my child. They won the Region but everyone else rolls their eyes when they talk about how they won it.

AM's 13u team only has 13 players and I have on very good authority that at least 5 of those players ASKED to come to the team. As far as the 6 getting the team over the hump at regionals, her starter's for the team include 3 of her returning players.

[hoopsdiva27]

I was under the impression that the FFS held open tryouts every spring for the upcoming season. I am not sure how open it is but wouldn't that send a message that loyalty is not an issue and that every year you must work to regain your place in the program. Seems to me that is a life lesson that the girls get to learn early on and not just because you have been with the program for umteen years that you automatically have a place. The beauty of PV is that there are so many teams here if you are not happy with the program you are in there is always another team with a vacant spot.

[michaeliceman]

Thanks for the corrections. Although each time I saw them play they had more than 13 players and 3 of the starters were the new kids and 2 were returning. So I am sure that they change the line-ups and such. As far as your good authority telling you that they asked to come on the team. You may be right. I heard the story from someone very close to the situation and I was relaying what I was told. But they may have been biased in that they were involved. The point of my post was that if I were a parent in that situation, I would question the FFS' commitment to the development of the kids already in the program who had been loyal.

I agree that no spot is guaranteed. It is a life lesson for those kids. But then do not promote the coach or the organization as beng interested in skill development. Be upfront. Tell parents that "We are an elite orgnaization and we are here to win national championships and if someone better than your kid comes along, your kid is gone." Personally, I have an issue with "win and all cost" youth sports organizations. Hey, if they want to be that way, then fine. It is obvious just based on some of the feelings in this thread, that the FFS trigger emotions on both sides of the argument.

[arbitraryj]

I was under the impression that the FFS held open tryouts every spring for the upcoming season. I am not sure how open it is but wouldn't that send a message that loyalty is not an issue and that every year you must work to regain your place in the program.

I've seen both sides of an "open" tryout. There is no such thing. Most teams (not just the ffs) have a few open SPOTS but not an open roster. A no-slot-is-secure-lets-see-who-wants-it tryout rarely happens. However, they will always be OPEN to take your registration fees. maybe that's what open tryout really means.

I think kids would appreciate knowing which slots were available upfront. If my kid doesn't meet the search requirements, we can go elsewhere - no harm done. If so, stay and grind it out for a spot as best you can. Don't let a post that can't dribble tryout for a team that's only looking for a point.

That open tryout thing is the same line clubs feed you after they tell you how they focus on academics first and development is soooo important.

Sponorship comes from notoriety. Notoriety comes from winning. Winning comes from development.

no issues here.

Recruiting seeks to capitalize on someone else's efforts to develop. Its a short cut to a win in an effort to get notoriety and the money that it brings.

[fhire]

I think it is a basic human feeling to want to win at tidalee winks up to basketball in all facets of life. I also think its human to want to win at all cost the flipside is the consequence of the action the embarrasment of being taken to task for all to see! Its just FFS turn to eat crow! Sad, but all of your so called elite teams struggle to stay hot on the national scene its what drives their program and drives people to the program. That all powerful word in select team community "Expousure"! FFS and LM will get through it and won't loose many of their top kids and more top kids will still want to play with them. I'm not defending them in any since but most of your so called elite teams use player all of the country and world to play on their team and the kids come because they want that all important "EXPOSURE" Hell kids come from all over to play for Boo, Philly Belles, Team Unique, West Coast Elite and the like! The only thing that will happened to Fairfax is the won't be able to have that team compete in the AAU Nationals big Whoop most of the top 16 teams aren't their anyway and besides its only 1 tourney!! The rest of the summer there team full of ringers can play together in perfect harmony!! Latte Tyme

[asiancoach]

My daughter tried out for FFS I was told how they develop kids and this and that and if I bring her into tryouts that they would work with her. Well she was cut and it cost me $25 I wasn't mad because her game stinks anyway but shes tall and she loves basketball (she does'nt know her game stinks)

It seems like from the tread its a good thing that she was cut, and from the other tread it seems like the L word Majic runs the same type off program.

My question is what are the differences between the L word Majic and the FFS, what are the similarities or are they both the same with different names?

[bballmom]

New kids came from an elite team that had finished top ten last two years. The Vogues 93s killed everyone for two years. AM has been knocking on every kids door from that team for a long time. Even with the new kids they coulodn't even win their own SRT, and the only reason they won district is because what was left of the same Vogues team that destroyed them in their own SRT had key injuries during districts. Still, FFS has yet to beat them I think.

AM promises kids scholarships, feeds on the fears of parents and kids about their futures and basically tells lies in order to recruit young kids. I hope NIke wakes up and smells the coffee and dumps their sorry program.

When will the PG folks open their eyes and realize that our kids are being used by those carpetbaggers? AM and BM used up their tokens in VA so now they want PG. I say we should stay at home.

[lboogie]

Nike sponsors TEAMS not PROGRAMS. The FFS have one sponsored Nike team. The other teams of course wear Nike gear but they pay just like every other AAU team.

[smokeyhip]

New kids came from an elite team that had finished top ten last two years. The Vogues 93s killed everyone for two years. AM has been knocking on every kids door from that team for a long time. Even with the new kids they coulodn't even win their own SRT, and the only reason they won district is because what was left of the same Vogues team that destroyed them in their own SRT had key injuries during districts. Still, FFS has yet to beat them I think.

AM promises kids scholarships, feeds on the fears of parents and kids about their futures and basically tells lies in order to recruit young kids. I hope NIke wakes up and smells the coffee and dumps their sorry program.

When will the PG folks open their eyes and realize that our kids are being used by those carpetbaggers? AM and BM used up their tokens in VA so now they want PG. I say we should stay at home.

Hot Dag!
I agree with you, the problem is what program in PG is willing to be visionary, collaborative, and develop a program?What do you mean by AM and BM wanting PG? Who are they courting? Who is AM and BM anyway? :cool:

[hoopsfl]

Nike sponsors TEAMS not PROGRAMS. The FFS have one sponsored Nike team. The other teams of course wear Nike gear but they pay just like every other AAU team.

Below is how they represent the Nike affiliation. Nike may only sponsor one FFS team, but clearly their relationship is with the entire program.

[/I]2004 also saw the Fairfax Stars AAU Basketball program selected for an affiliate relationship with Nike. The Fairfax Stars girls program became a Nike-afffiliate program, adding to the opportunities for participation in tournaments, camps, and clinics.

[hoopsfl]

AM & BM are Aggie and brother Bob McCormick, founders of the Stars. You can view their bio's on the FFS website. After reading hers, AM seems only one step from Sainthood.

http://www.fairfaxstars.org/coaches.asp

[hoopsdiva27]

New kids came from an elite team that had finished top ten last two years. The Vogues 93s killed everyone for two years. AM has been knocking on every kids door from that team for a long time. Even with the new kids they coulodn't even win their own SRT, and the only reason they won district is because what was left of the same Vogues team that destroyed them in their own SRT had key injuries during districts. Still, FFS has yet to beat them I think.

You are saying they have a bunch of scrubs and couldnt win their own SRT. Why is there a whole thread dedicated to the FFS stealing players? If the FFS didnt take them, would anyone else have picked them up?

[spwri]

There is a big difference in the program because the Majic don't have anything to sell
no shoe deals no contract just good quality bball and there was no ruling on the majic
they provided the correct document that the Fairfax Star didnt,like I said before you have
go thru the proper chanels, you cant do what you want to do because your the Fairfax
Stars beside you cant report anyone for having a dirty kitchen and your is full of dirt did
they want the 1 seed that bad . Once again this is just girls basketball no one is getting
paid, Also I would be the first to say good luck to Coach Johnson and the 14's good luck
at Nationals

[intelligenthoodlum]

A high-end spring/summer program should have:
1. quality individual skill development through training;
2. effective team strategies through practice;
3. good-enough game coaching;
4. placement in relevant events;
5. proper showcasing of talent in the events;
6. appropriate relationships with college coaches;
7. good-enough relationships with the relevant high-school coaches;
8. game plans for continued development of returning players;
9. recruiting skills, ethical and comprehensive, to bring in the appropriate new players;
10. a well-defined program culture, which identifies the program to its players and to the public.
The IH wants you sports fans to look at each one of the area's programs, and look at how many of these ten requirements each one of these programs meets...

[michaeliceman]

Response to Hoops Diva. Yea, other teams would have picked them up. In fact, they had "supposedly" committed to another team (the coach had even ordered their uniforms) when they changed course and went to the FFS. To be honest, they are all good kids and good players. They would have helped a lot of teams. I saw all of their games at the SRT and they did not win because they had not developed any chemistry between the new kids and the old kids.

Also, these kids did not come from the Elite team that finished in the top 10 (that was the Mid-Atlantic Elite from Philly). Three of the kids played for the East Coast Elite (which was a short lived team based in PV). Before that, two played for the 93 Vogues, two for the 93 LM and Team Select, one for the Flames and another one was from a Southern Maryland team.

[teammom4]

I was wondering what happened to the FFS buzz on the board so far this summer it hadn't been much. I don't know about all the programs in the area by far. I thought the particular FF team we were talking about was the Elite team therefore they had different rules than the AAU teams & if that's the case nothing was wrong with the team, until of course, they tried to enter in Natl's...OTOH, I feel bad for any lil Faifax raised kids that only dream of filling JT & Chay's shoes, only to be ousted by out-of-towners, that sucks!
In terms of them & their development, I had the privilege of seeing Chay when she was a 7th grader. She really only knew how to stand in the middle & wait for the ball, by the end of her 8th grade season she was pretty much the player I have been seeing over the past three years. Her development was essentially at a standstill, yet good enough (with the right pedigree) to have her where she is now. I saw the new FF under KB play once or twice & had noticed she was taking on some different habits like being fiesty & emotional, maybe like her coach, but I wouldn't say that's a bad thing as long as it's under control.
As a parent, you guys are killing me saying teams steal players. That's MY kid & I will make the decisions with some input from HER. A team does not own my child. Loyalty is EVERYTHING to me, if I SEE a "better" situation for my girl, I will ensure that she's able to participate without feeling like she is being a crook! I emphasized see because people can talk until they are blue in the face, you have to pay attention to what is actually going on to get the real info.

[hoopsfl]

I think the bottom line here is that FFS has a well deserved reputation for constantly overhauling teams with top players wherever they can find them in order to win and establish / keep their national reputation.

If that means tossing aside loyal kids that have been with their program, so be it. If it means promising prospective transfer kids with exposure and denegrating other clubs or coaches to get the kids to leave, so be it.

Clearly from previous posts on this topic, some of us have witnessed this first hand.

[HighLevel]

As a parent, you guys are killing me saying teams steal players. That's MY kid & I will make the decisions with some input from HER. A team does not own my child. Loyalty is EVERYTHING to me, if I SEE a "better" situation for my girl, I will ensure that she's able to participate without feeling like she is being a crook! I emphasized see because people can talk until they are blue in the face, you have to pay attention to what is actually going on to get the real info.

Thank you for speakin' the gospel. Tell em again! I carried that child for 9 months!!!

[bballfan]

With all the FFs talk going on, I guess another question would be...Do you take your child to an established, nationally known program like the Stars or a smaller program where they can get the attention and develop into a better player? And can your child get exposure if they aren't playing on one of the known teams.

[michaeliceman]

What do people mean when they say "stealing players?" We all know they are not kidnapping these kids in the middle of the night. LOL!! But if a coach comes to one of my players, makes a lot of false promises, and criticizes me in the process, does that make it the right way to recruit? My point is that I agree that parents are the ones who decide to move kids - not coaches. But you have to assume that the parents are basing that decision on something. Most prudent parents will do the research and determine what is the best fit. But a lot of coaches (not just the FFS) will give parents inaccurate info or even lie to get the parents to move the kid. In my mind, that is not right.

With my daughter, we had the opportunity to move her to the FFS. I left her in her current organization because she has great coaches and these coaches do a great job of developing the kids while also showcasing them. I do not care one bit about the national prestige of a club. I look at what his best for my kid. Honestly, we have not had a problem with scouts finding the girls on the team. They do the showcase circuit and all of that.

[teammom4]

These days girls are playing for multiple teams all year around..they may play with their HS team & on the weekends they run with another league. Not to mention in the "off-season" when they run with 2 or more AAU/Club teams & a few HS teams in between!!
BOTH (development & exposure) aspects are equally as important.(although with the afformentioned trend building it seem exposure is on everybody's mind!)
My daughter had other varibles coming in, but except for Gatorade POY, she essentially was nowhere on the National radar until her rising Sr. season when she was on BWE. I say on instead of played for because her PT was scarce, BUT she was able to display her skills enough to be a really hot item on the scene by summer's end. She obviously was developed enough to be seen by BW for exposure. That's how most "Elite" teams operate. Because she was playing for BW, didn't mean she no longer played for her team. Her HS team was in summer leagues and tournies & in between the BW tourneys she played & worked out with them & her coach. When it came down to it, her loyalty lied with her HS team & the one time when the two teams had conflicting tourneys it was established in advance she would play with her HS team. That is because we had open dialogue, and all parties involved were in it for the best interest of the kid.
Exposure is a word with many meanings, for my kid it meant to the National scenes, to different parts of the country that otherwise may not have been visited and to other skilled athletes, not just scouts! To some it will mean exposing themselves or worse their kids!
The most important thing is be informed! We knew exactly what she was getting when she signed up. KNOW WHAT YOUR GETTING INTO!!

[teammom4]

Quote: "If a coach comes to one of my players, makes a lot of false promises, and criticizes me in the process, does that make it the right way to recruit? My point is that I agree that parents are the ones who decide to move kids - not coaches. But you have to assume that the parents are basing that decision on something."

That's another issue! Parents I think are putting winning at all cost in front of a lot more important decisions they shouls be making with their kids lives. If you can smell the stank coming off of some of these coaches why buy into it? Why watch a coach curse his kids out in the win & aspire for your kid to play for him? Do you think it will be different for your kid.
CHARACTER IS Most IMPORTANT!
If someone displays some of the things you're looking for & good character traits, that should be your first choice! I am speaking from experience!:)

[hoopsfl]

Originally Posted by teammom4
As a parent, you guys are killing me saying teams steal players. That's MY kid & I will make the decisions with some input from HER. A team does not own my child. Loyalty is EVERYTHING to me, if I SEE a "better" situation for my girl, I will ensure that she's able to participate without feeling like she is being a crook! I emphasized see because people can talk until they are blue in the face, you have to pay attention to what is actually going on to get the real info.

Thank you for speakin' the gospel. Tell em again! I carried that child for 9 months!!!

I'm not accusing you tmm, but sometimes parents are a big part of the problem. I've personally seen parents remove their daughter from one club after their daughter was selected for one club team and move them to another club team. On each occasion where this happened...drum role please...it was the FFS that ended up with the kid.

I'm sure it was just coincidence.

[teammom4]

Originally Posted by teammom4
As a parent, you guys are killing me saying teams steal players. That's MY kid & I will make the decisions with some input from HER. A team does not own my child. Loyalty is EVERYTHING to me, if I SEE a "better" situation for my girl, I will ensure that she's able to participate without feeling like she is being a crook! I emphasized see because people can talk until they are blue in the face, you have to pay attention to what is actually going on to get the real info.

Thank you for speakin' the gospel. Tell em again! I carried that child for 9 months!!!

I'm not accusing you tmm, but sometimes parents are a big part of the problem. I've personally seen parents remove their daughter from one club after their daughter was selected for one club team and move them to another club team. On each occasion where this happened...drum role please...it was the FFS that ended up with the kid.

I'm sure it was just coincidence.

I personally don't feel like your post was for me so I don't feel accused or offended.
That is what I followed up in my other post & expressed. You may just be privy to this info., but believe me its happening across the map! In Chicago Fenwick is complaining about the Family who is based out of Indiana & their tactics for getting players & so on & so forth!
I'm not saying what FF or any of the teams is doing is right, but maybe some of the parents are wrong. They put exposure & W's in front of making a sound decision for a kid's best interest. I approached my daughter's HS choice with the same caution I did her collegiate choice & I would advise you parents to do the same for HS & now what seems to be the circus scene of summer ball, or there will be no collegiate career!
Oh & HL, we carry those babies for 10 mos., how dare they think someone can steal 'em! :)

[ballaholicgirl17]

Considering that it's "ALL ABOUT THE KIDS," please do not post negative remarks and comments about their Coach and Mentor. They read these logs daily because they love the game and want to keep posted on current events. It's very devastating to read hateful remarks about someone that they love and look up to.

As for the FFS 16U Elite Team: It's unfortunate that you won't have an opportunity to attend Nationals this year (if that's true)...especially for the 2008 Grads. Keep your heads up Girls and keep working hard.

[bigmac]

Two years ago this same team was disqualified from u-14 regionals because of to many out of district players. How can you do this again????

[pgmom]

the reason a family and player switch often has more to do with the realization that the current situation is not what it should be FOR THAT PLAYER, and less to do with any promises made from outside clubs. In our family experience, we only looked at a new program when the current program was not a good fit for our daughter and she was clearly not happy with the way things were going. In one case, despite us being completely up front about her needs and why she needed to look for something new, the word on the street ended up being that some coach stole her and the old coach and organization did all they could to drag the new coaches name through the mud. There was even a certain amount of venom directed at our daughter by adults involved. It was awful to witness and years later the old coach still can't look us in the eye despite our having being upfront all along. So who is it really about in his world?? The egos for some coaches are fragile, just like a spurned lover, and there is a lot of "ownership" language used, like X "stole my player." Excuse me, but nobody owns my baby, not even me.!!

[teammom4]

It could be any of several reasons a player & fam decides they want out. Opportunity on the other side, no opportunity on this side, wins, money, PT, team squabbles, inconveniences, location etc..
If the kid is talented enough to be noticed, her absence from her former team & presence with her current team will be speculated upon by many. If YOU know what you did and why and you can still hold your head up, that's what counts. If someone came to me bashing ANYTHING, they would get a sideways look because in no way would I want my child being exposed to those tendencies.
If you want your child to play @ the college level..LEARN HOW TO PEEP GAME NOW! As open & honest as we would want everyone to be, the truth is that some are not & they may tell you whatever they want to get your kid. This is just the beginning!

[hoopsdiva27]

Bottom line is it is what it is--the beauty/or beast of PVAAU is there are so many teams here that if your child is not happy with PT, development, or make up of the team you can always find another place to play. I feel alot of bitterness towards the FFS on this board which I could sympathize with because one of my kids was cut from a Stars team to make way for players brought over from PG. But her love of the game did not let that stop her, she opted to go play in PG where she contiues to development. Which addresses another issue on this thread that PG players should stay in PG. Where would that leave my child who is a NoVAnite? Does that mean should not play in PG? Why can't PV players play for PV teams regardless of what side of the bridge you live on?

[talk2me]

Seems to me that the powers that be have always succumb to their own agendas (...fill in the blank) as opposed to furthering the development and advancement of the kids involved in bball in this metro area. The underlying messages I'm hearing goes to the reason why such outsiders (nothing against BW) can come to the metro and recruit our kids. There's no cooperation or camaraderie amongst the trusted in the metro to ensure that the kids get what they need to become/remain top tier talents in the country, and keep the metro a vital recruiting bed for all coaches at all levels. Just think......there are far too many isolated programs in this small area diluting the prospects of us having nationally competitive teams "with an 's" opposed to having 1 or 2 talents on numerous less experienced or less competitive teams....Parents and Coaches together should be working to improve their situations without egos of my kid should be the star of the team or i'll go start my own team or i should be the coach not you so i'll go start my own program, etc, etc, etc. Can we not work together for all our kids? Just because the kid does not play for you doesn't mean you can't support them. Wish them well and assist as much as you can when they ask for it....Don't turn away!!! Compete when necessary but always support.

[ballaholicgirl17]

Two years ago this same team was disqualified from u-14 regionals because of to many out of district players. How can you do this again????

Well well well...lets clear this up. Shall we?? The team that got disqualifiied from the regional tourney is NOT the 16u elite team to this day. Most of those players...actually the majority of those players were playing up at the time. So they were on the 15U team...not the 14. The 15U gold team that year reached 2nd in the nation!...get your facts straight before you post stuff like that.

[shiningSTaR]

I have sat back and watched this thread take a life of its own and decided I needed to chime in. I am not sure how a thread that began about the FFS elite team moved to the 13s but whatever. My daughter plays on this 93 team and she was one of the mentioned that came over this spring but she was not approached nor did anyone bang on her door. Her LM team from last summer folded and she was looking for a place to play. And contrary to other's belief it had nothing to do with development or playing time but everything to do with where she felt most comfortable. She loves this team and more important she thinks the world of Aggie. When trying to decide where to play there was no question that if Aggie wanted her that is where she would go. And like others on this board she was once cut by the Stars and boy were we bitter for a minute but she realized that was the best thing that happened to her. She was welcomed with open arms by the Lady Majic and rec'd oodles of help on her game(which she needs) but when the team opted not to continue we thought the most logically thing would be to return to the FFS to play with her friends -nothing more nothing less--unlike some on this board, she does not eat, sleep and drink basketball--in all actuality basketball is not even her main sport but she likes the game and wanted to play with the hopes of working on her game to maybe make a contribution to her high school freshman or maybe even the JV squad this winter. And she is not the only one, if you approached many of the girls in the program they will tell you the same thing--they love the program. I have witnessed genuine emotion from AM and her family that this feeling is mutual. Some on this thread have dogged AM for wanting a winning program--who doesn't. Which girl out there in PV doesn't want to win? Why are they spending so much time developing? to lose? Ok so others are sometimes brought onto a team to fill in where pieces are missing, that is real life. I will end this long drawn out babble but before you throw stones to AM and the FFS look in your own back yard. Is your program on the up and up, always playing by the exact rules? If not think real hard before you trash thirteen young ladies' coach and mentor.

[arbitraryj]

(ringy-dingy) Rise and shine star! This is guest services with your complementary wake up call. We wish you and your family all the best regards for a truly wonderful day! Good luck with that path but please be advised of the following:

The FFS threat level for today is Severe, or Red, for all domestic and international families seeking satisfying experiences with PT, development, or make up of the team. Only small amounts of hope, optimism and naiveté are allowed in carry-on baggage.

See the HoopGurlz Security Administration (HSA) website for up-to-date information on items permitted and prohibited in scheduled tryouts, practices, and sanctioned tournaments. Please reference the last six pages of board community accounts.

Recommended Activities
*All Americans should continue to be vigilant, take notice of their surroundings, and report suspicious items or activities to local authorities immediately. We promise not to say we told you so. Our aim is only to help.

* Everyone should establish an emergency preparedness kit and emergency plan for themselves and their daughters, and stay informed about what to do during an emergency.

*FFS authorities as well as all other divisions of the Department of Potomac Valley Basketball should take full advantage of this opportunity to learn from this particularly harsh information and immediately get back the business of helping kids learn and love the game.

:D

[lboogie]

We needed a little levity to break the tension.
http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/images/blpic-ducttapedbushies.htm

[shiningSTaR]

I will take your public service announcement under advisement but when its all said and done AJ, its only basketball not a natural disaster. Before the round orange ball came into her life, she was going to college and if that hoop dream she is chasing doesn't exist, she will still go based on her academics. Its not that serious!

[lboogie]

We needed a little levity to break the tension.
Who's getting the duct tape and bottle water?
http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/images/blpic-ducttapedbushies.htm

[ballaholicgirl17]

I have sat back and watched this thread take a life of its own and decided I needed to chime in. I am not sure how a thread that began about the FFS elite team moved to the 13s but whatever. My daughter plays on this 93 team and she was one of the mentioned that came over this spring but she was not approached nor did anyone bang on her door. Her LM team from last summer folded and she was looking for a place to play. And contrary to other's belief it had nothing to do with development or playing time but everything to do with where she felt most comfortable. She loves this team and more important she thinks the world of Aggie. When trying to decide where to play there was no question that if Aggie wanted her that is where she would go. And like others on this board she was once cut by the Stars and boy were we bitter for a minute but she realized that was the best thing that happened to her. She was welcomed with open arms by the Lady Majic and rec'd oodles of help on her game(which she needs) but when the team opted not to continue we thought the most logically thing would be to return to the FFS to play with her friends -nothing more nothing less--unlike some on this board, she does not eat, sleep and drink basketball--in all actuality basketball is not even her main sport but she likes the game and wanted to play with the hopes of working on her game to maybe make a contribution to her high school freshman or maybe even the JV squad this winter. And she is not the only one, if you approached many of the girls in the program they will tell you the same thing--they love the program. I have witnessed genuine emotion from AM and her family that this feeling is mutual. Some on this thread have dogged AM for wanting a winning program--who doesn't. Which girl out there in PV doesn't want to win? Why are they spending so much time developing? to lose? Ok so others are sometimes brought onto a team to fill in where pieces are missing, that is real life. I will end this long drawn out babble but before you throw stones to AM and the FFS look in your own back yard. Is your program on the up and up, always playing by the exact rules? If not think real hard before you trash thirteen young ladies' coach and mentor.


i completely agree to this comment!! GREAT JOB shiningSTaR!!!

[4street]

I just love it when people mask their frustrations/envy/jealousies/ just plain old "hateration" behind concern for the kids.

[ballaholicgirl17]

I just love it when people mask their frustrations/envy/jealousies/ just plain old "hateration" behind concern for the kids.


may u explain???

[shiningSTaR]

I just love it when people mask their frustrations/envy/jealousies/ just plain old "hateration" behind concern for the kids.

Lots of folks are sippin on the "haterade"--pls put the bottle down-- you will live longer:D

[hoopsfl]

Let's not be intellectually lazy. Just because a lot of us on this particular thread object to certain practices of the FFS, it doesn't make anyone a hater. If your experience with FFS has been positive, great. From much of the comments, there's another side to that program that some find objectionable.

[hoopsdiva27]

I don't think calling out the haters is a lazy comment. I honestly believe because her program is successful that it makes her an easy target and I really believe if a guy was running FFS no one would care what method they used to pick up players

[4street]

You most certainly have the right to object to their or anyone elses practices. However, the nature of the objections on this board can most certainly be identified as hating, jealousy, envy, etc. "knocking on doors and stealing kids." The brother having the audacity to wear a windbreaker noting the national championship he won. Fairfax Stars don't develop players. They're a disloyal organization because they cut kids during tryouts who may have played there before. They're a fraudulent organization because they have kids who play who aren't from Fairfax. Let me let you in on a little secret ***teams have been winning the WCAC for years with players who aren't Catholic***. Reading this thread, Aggie McCormick makes Atillah the Hun and Ghengis Khan seem like punks.

[hoopsdiva27]

I will stop here and agree to disagree:cool:

[lboogie]

I asked once in this thread to keep it civil...